Has this happened to you?
Have you read a Tweet by someone that says, “Mayor who wanted to erect ten commandments tablets in front of City Hall loses in court,” and smiled? Or even smirked, or said “awesome!” to yourself? Have you ever cheered when hearing about a teacher getting suspended for trying to force school children into daily prayer? Do you ever laugh at a Christian who tries to debate Richard Dawkins and fails miserably?
Those things are “bad” to Christians and other believers. Of course, the concept of “bad” is relative (for those who reason), but it’s generally accepted by believers (or, more specifically, evangelicals, fundamentalists, and even a lot of moderates who care) that failure to influence others with regard to their chosen religion is a bad thing. It’s losing ground in the “fight” against the heathens, the godless, and sin. It’s also quite often an emotional experience for believers to lose, for they hold close to their faith, and are empowered by it.
Is it right for atheists to revel in victory? Is is honorable, rational, or productive to laugh in the face of a fallen opponent? Have centuries of oppression and fear caused us to suffer from nervous laughter syndrome, whereby our repressed emotions and need to express ourselves manifest derision and ridicule at even the slightest slip by our oppressors? Is it healthy or beneficial for us to perpetuate such reactions? Do we threaten the already tenuous relations between believers and non-believers?
I don’t ask all of these questions rhetorically. I’d really like to know what others think. I, myself, am guilty of feeling pleased, perhaps in an act of self-righteous justification, when I read about court decisions that interpret the First Amendment the way I think it should be interpreted, despite the fact that somewhere, there is a person who lost that case who cared deeply about it. Do I owe that person a modicum of respect? Do I really disrespect that person or show some sort of evil “true colors” if I choose to cheer when I think justice has been done and freedom from religion is further secured? With these thoughts I am struck.
Tags: Atheism, Christianity, court, honor, Religion
I do feel elated when I hear of the examples you present here. When a court rules on the “separation clause” in certain cases it’s quite obvious in the vast majority of cases that separation of church and state is altogether intact (though loosely).
And no I don’t feel in any way “bad” about my feelings about the “other” party getting the shaft. After all I wasn’t the one giving the shaft nor should we even consider or believe that a certain party was getting shafted to begin with. The law is the law.
Ugh: http://edition.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/09/18/florida.school.prayer/index.html?eref=edition_us
“The tradition of offering prayer in America has become so interwoven into our nation’s spiritual heritage that to charge someone criminally for engaging in such a practice would astonish the men who founded this country on religious liberty.”
Bullshit.
I think it is OK to “feel good” when you’ve been proven right. I believe that when a person is right, the happy-feel-good-dopamine reward system is triggered in the brain. It is a way to reinforce correct behavior.
I am not sure that we (humans) have much of a choice in the matter of feeling good when we’re correct.
Does a samurai feel bad for slaughtering 100 inferior enemies in a battle?
I’ll speak honestly. I’m delighted at those examples. I chuckle and I mentally I laugh at the idiot fundies when they get their comeuppance. Every second of every day they judge everyone who doesn’t believe their insanity to be wretched, immoral people worthy of nothing more than eternity in torture. I should give a shit when they are held accountable in this reality? Not so much. Hell, I even laugh at them when they aren’t caught with a hooker or don’t make a fool out of themselves by their stupid anti-evolution comments. While they are judging me to be immoral, I am laughing at them for being idiots. 24/7
I don’t get happy when bad things happen to Christians, I get happy when bad things happen to shitheads.
A Christian victory isn’t really good for other believers either. I mean that just means Christianity is one step closer to wiping thier beliefs of the planet.
Honestly yes I am pleased because I mean really theres a reason that the church and state are seperate; theocracy anyone?
Besides a teacher trying to force prayer or saying all americans pray is dumb. There are a lot of other religions in America besides just Christianity and your ignorance of this fact was shown with every word of this article.
Hold on I just reread the last paragraph, I cancel out my last paragraph in previous comment about ignorance.
See vjack’s response at Atheist Revolution.
The premise here is that somebody feels bad because circumstances force them further away from attaining a goal that is important to them. You use the examples of Christian activists being thwarted in their goal of spreading their religion to others, but the same principle holds for everybody about every goal that is important to them.
The corollary is that somebody feels good when circumstances move them closer to attaining a goal that is important to them. In the above example, some secular activists will feel good because they have been moved closer to the goal of a secular society, and other secular activists will feel good because they also have a goal (perhaps more subliminal) of seeing Christian activists personally humiliated.
With regard to your question, I suggest that the first reason for secular activists feeling good should be welcomed, while the second should be questioned to see if it is consistent with the overall system of ethics that the person wants to live by.
Michael, I agree with that distinction. And I especially appreciate how you’ve formed the second reason analysis into a standards query rather than a knee-jerk accusation, and, interestingly, not from an outsider’s point of view, but from the perspective of the person who feels good. I think you’re dead on, and have been helpful in my own self-analysis. Thanks!
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